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Browns receive lesser of Oakland's two third rounders

The Browns will receive pick No. 85 in exchange for outside linebacker Kamerion Wimbley. That is the pick the Raiders acquired from the Patriots in Derrick Burgess deal.

In that trade, the Raiders a fourth-round pick and essentially a 26-year-old pass rusher in Wimbley for Burgess. Not a bad trade off. That's right, Oakland made a good move. I'm stunned too.

The Browns have not officially announced the trade, but that should happen this afternoon.

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Other than the stupidly high tender given Stanford Routt...

…I can’t complain about a single decision Al Davis has made thus far this off-season. Someone either locked the old man in a closet or has got him on mood stabilizers.

"'Tis a bird I love, with its brooding note, And the trembling throb in its mottled throat; There's a human look in its swelling breast, And the gentle curve of its lowly crest; And I often stop with the fear I feel-- He runs so close to the rapid wheel." Nathaniel Parker Willis, "The Belfrey Pigeon"

by Raybin on Mar 15, 2010 12:43 PM EDT reply actions  

Of course that it would be the Browns that get hoodwinked by the Raiders...

…all that’s left to do is for the Chiefs to pull a fast one on the Detroit Lions and St. Louis Rams.

by Richard Hill on Mar 15, 2010 1:12 PM EDT reply actions  

wow…seriously???

Browns that get hoodwinked by the Raiders…

I am guessing you are still looking at wimbley by his draft measurables and not his inconsistent and lackluster on the field production. he has not consistently produced at any level.

He has never been a consistent player, even going back to his rookie season.

First 3 starts: 3 sacks, 10 total tackles
Next 3 starts: 0 sacks, 8 total Tackles
Next 3: 3.5 Sacks 15 Total Tackles
Next 3: 1 Sack 10 Total Tackles
Next 3: 3.5 Sacks, 16 Total Tackles..

does that look like a guy you can rely upon week in and week out? No, he gets hot and cold.

2007: 5 games (ignoring game 1 with 2 total tackles) 20 tackles, 3 sacks. Next 10, 2 sacks, 29 tackles…

2009: First 7 games: 40 tackles, 5 sacks. Next 8: 19 Tackles, 1.5 Sacks…

Yeah, this guy is such a consistent player.

He was never a good player and had one good season (college or pros). He had 12 total sacks in 3 years in college and besides his rookie season, has had 15.5 sacks in 3 seasons…nothing all that impressive.

by bross09 on Mar 15, 2010 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes. Seriously.

Teams adjust to cover the player who is hot- it’s very rare that a player will be unstoppable for an entire season. Even if he drops to the 1 sack/3 game rate, he’ll still post upwards of 5 sacks on the year, which is more than reasonable for the second of their third round picks. If he posts closer to 2 sacks/3 games, that brings him to a 10 sack/season range, which, in my opinion, would be a no brainer for a 3rd round pick.

by Richard Hill on Mar 15, 2010 10:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

You really think he will post 10 sacks a year though? I see him as being more around 6 next year. for the third rounder, that isn’t a bad deal, but it isn’t fleecing the browns.

Wimbley has the body and the playing style of a tweener. He is a smaller DE even for a pure pass rusher. He is successful when he can stand up and not line up in front of the tackle on every play. He also doesn’t have great pass rush moves. to get past a LT in this league there are a few ways you can do it:

a) Try to run around him. this is usually the least effective strategy. not only do you need elite speed but it doesn’t often work on the better, more athletic tackles. This is wimbley’s main strategy

b) Bull rush the guy or use your strength. Many guys try to use their strength at least somewhat. Wimbley cannot overpower many lineman or use his strength well to his advantage.

c) Pass Rush moves. This is what some of the best use. the out technique the other guy. Wimbley can do this but his pass rush moves are not overly effective.

Speed rushing is the main thing wimbley does. this is often much more effective in a 3-4 compared to a 4-3.

and I understand that guys can be adjusted to. however, also look at the tackles. during the off periods he was also making significantly less tackles. you could say that they put more focus on stopping him, but a good player will find a way to get the tackles. The tackles should stay at least somewhat consistent, but they don’t. If he isn’t getting significant amounts of tackles, coupled with a drop iin sacks, what this shows me is that he is a streaky player. he has been like that his whole pro career. Its not a case of being gameplanned against more so it is a case of a guy underachieving.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 15, 2010 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Browns didn’t get hoodwinked at all. We got a decent pick for an otherwise useless guy that was expendable. Good move for the Browns.

by Legoman0721 on Mar 15, 2010 1:19 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Useless?

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 15, 2010 8:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

I would say he was fairly useless this year at QB. he might have some potential, but personally I am happy with what the browns got.

you can’t really get more than a 5th right now for quinn. that is the league evaluation of his worth. His worth is Peyton Hillis (who i think is worth a fifth round pick…I would trade one of the browns’ for him) and a couple mid-late round picks.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 15, 2010 9:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wimbley always looked solid to me

Does Holgren know what he’s doing?

Old school tin foil must be used, not the aluminum crap.

by Foilhat on Mar 15, 2010 2:00 PM EDT reply actions  

yeah…he was not all that good. he was an extremely streaky player who would be great for a while but then drop off the face of the earth (like 5 sacks and 40 tackles for 7 games…the next 8, 1.5 sacks and 19 tackles). He was a decent player but easily replacable. He was never a consistent player in college or in the pros. in fact, I believe he was massively overvalued and overdrafted. with his physical skills and production, he would be an early 2nd rounder IMO in this draft. he is JPP…no good stats in college, great physical specimen. JPP will be overdrafted to b/c of “upside”. If a guy can’t get to opposing QBs consistently in college, they have even more trouble in the pros. WImbley had 4.5 sacks in 2 starting seasons until he had 7.5 his senior year. those are still not good stats. guy with great physical skills often get overdrafted b/c of “upside”. Sacks translate well to the NFL. a guy that can’t get to the QB in the ACC or Big East will not be able to do it consistently in the pros.

by bross09 on Mar 15, 2010 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Was he not the best Browns pass rusher

Or am I forgetting someone

Old school tin foil must be used, not the aluminum crap.

by Foilhat on Mar 15, 2010 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

He was.

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 15, 2010 8:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

disagree.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 15, 2010 9:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

as an ACTUAL browns fan, not a BQ fan.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 15, 2010 9:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

HAHA

Nice. Yeah I need the opinion of a Browns fan, not a BQ turned Broncos fan.

by Foilhat on Mar 15, 2010 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Why? Did I suddenly forget everything?

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 15, 2010 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Apparently

You forgot the meaning of being a fan, but hey to each their own I guess. I mean you’re talking to a Chargers fan here than is routinely embarrassed by the club. I might not renew my season tickets or get upset; but I wouldnt change my colors over a mediocre QB even if he was my own brother.

by Foilhat on Mar 15, 2010 10:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

he is a ND fan…that is why he is switching.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 15, 2010 11:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Poor you, you had to root for a playoff team from your city. That must have been tough

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 16, 2010 12:02 AM EDT up reply actions  

poor you…you come off in many places (especially here at MTD) as this person who is gung ho about the browns…when you really only care about one player…

Have fun rooting for denver.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 16, 2010 1:47 AM EDT up reply actions  

Matt Roth.

Wimbley was wildly inconsistent and was a non factor once the rest of our pass rush picked up. in the first 7 games he played he had 5 sacks, the next 8 he had 1.5…so for half the season he was a nonfactor. he also had a lot less tackles during the latter stretch and was exposed more against the run.

He was not a factor at all in the browns surge at the end of the season.

He is a talented player but has been wildly inconsistent at every level of play. even his rookie season he would have great stretches (like 4 sacks and 20 tackles in 3 games) and then have terrible stretches (like 0 sacks and 8 total tackles in 3 games).

I could also argue david bowens is better and has been more consistent in his career when he has gotten playing time.

the problem is that Wimbley has elite physical skills, but

a) struggles in traffic and doesn’t work well in traffic.

b) struggles at getting around or getting free of tackles

c) struggles at using pass rush moves effectively.

on pure skill he will get some sacks, but he capitalizes on weaker tackles but struggles against good competition.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 15, 2010 9:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

You could argue Roth, but I still say Wimbley.

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 15, 2010 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

But I disagree. wimbley has one move. trying to outrun the guy. it works occasionally but doesn’t work consistently.

Roth doesn’t have the speed rush but he has better pass rushing moves and he has more strength. Roth does well when engaged and in traffic whereas wimbley struggles at times. Roth also is stronger than Wimbley and is much more able to use his strength.

Roth has a much higher motor than wimbley too. Roth just never stops and is relentless in this regard.

Roth is also great at getting leverage on guys and using it. This is a skill dumervil has and guys who don’t have top end speed often develop it, but wimbley still isn’t great in this area.

They are the complete opposite type of players though. Roth is a guy who doesn’t have elite physical skills but is a classic overachiever. he gives 110%, has a very high motor, and maximizes his talent.

honestly, looking back on scouting reports, wimbley’s main weaknesses were shedding blockers and his strength and using his strength…he still has not improved significantly on that.

WImbley is a guy who underachieves. Don’t get me wrong, he is a class act and I believe he tries hard but that doesn’t make him an underachiever, He has a boatload of talent but doesn’t capitalize on it well.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 15, 2010 11:59 PM EDT up reply actions  


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